I want to ask. If a asm program could code a huge and one of the best games like Microsoft Age Of Empires? If so how much he will burn his head and for how much approximate time? Is anyone already on any project like this here?;)
Posted on 2002-06-13 08:42:02 by Wonder Mage
Ask Bogdan :)
Posted on 2002-06-13 08:43:46 by bazik
I thought that you are not helpful.
Posted on 2002-06-13 08:46:52 by Wonder Mage
Actually Bogdan is working on a game called Hostile Encounters (http://hostileencounter.com/) and it's being coded entirely in asm.
Posted on 2002-06-13 08:54:22 by Will
I think it would take a single asm coder a long time to create something like age of empires. There is not just the programming there is the graphics/sound/maps etc, I think a game like this would be more suited to c++ and OOP
Posted on 2002-06-13 09:17:11 by Kudos
I always said that it will take me (and my team) about 6 months ;) to do a full game like Starcraft or AoE.

IF i have the required money funds to pay salary to the team and to buy tools (3D Max / Maya licences etc)

I probably exagerate a bit (and remember i personaly find ASM so much easy compared to C++) ... but i guess 1.5 years will do anyway.

Dont forget it took Blizzard 3 years with approx 12 programmers and 32 artists... look at Warcraft III .... good games are never done fast!


Besides that... Kudos ... the GFX,music sprites and models have no relevence to C/C++ or ASM programming using them is the same (of course i believe its much faster and easyer in ASM but its a personal oppinion)

I never had other problems but money into making our game. but you must understand that making such a big game needs a lot of money.

The alternative to money is time, and this is what we do with HE: we slowly develop it in weekends while we use other time to get money from other projects.

HE is pretty big: approx 200.000 lines of code and growing as we speak :)
Posted on 2002-06-13 11:29:20 by BogdanOntanu
well gave me your website 'hostile encounter' address now i am downloading your dec 01 game filez. Can i ask you something? well i want to ask that is age of empires, empires earth and agew of mythology games are all written in asm? as they have good playback.
Posted on 2002-06-14 08:09:56 by Wonder Mage
>well i want to ask that is age of empires, empires earth and
>agew of mythology games are all written in asm?

ROTFL!!!!


HE is the first 32bit RTS Game, written in 100% ASM (correct, Bogdan?)
Posted on 2002-06-14 08:27:58 by bazik
Can you please explain me what you have said?:)
Posted on 2002-06-14 08:41:37 by Wonder Mage
ROTFL = rolling on the floor laughing ;)

The rest means that Hostile Encounter is the first Real Time Strategy game (= players don't take turns as in chess) that is coded in 100% ASM :)
Posted on 2002-06-14 08:54:50 by Qweerdy
Wondermage: games are usually made in C or C++ with sometimes some asm to speed up crucial sections.

If you're interested in games go to http://www.gamedev.net and http://www.gamasutra.com where you'll find tutorials and how to's. You'll also see that most use C++

AFAIK Bogdan's game is the first game of this magnitude to be made completely in assembler under 32 bits Windows.
Posted on 2002-06-14 08:56:47 by Hiroshimator
Well they are not but AFAIK they sure have parts in ASM, almost any game will eventually have some optimized parts in ASM or else it will not be able to have its "cutting edge" competittive advantage to others.

Today PCs are not as fast as we use to believe... trust me ;)

But there are big games there that are indeed written in full ASM some of them look like AoE.

AFAIK Cosacks European Warrs is one of them, but there are many others just that producers do not advertize on this issue some even keep it secret becouse "is bad for the bussines"

we had our share comments on this from some potential producers also ... :(

PS
-----------------------
ROTFL = ROtate on the Floor Laughing ...

ie bazic is laughing hard ;)

Many ppl think doing a game in ASM is hard, bviousely i am against this, and after all this board is about Win32ASM. But makeing a good game is hard no mater the language ...so take care

Get Chriss Hobbs tetris game in full asm from gamedev.net its a very good tutorial and has all the parts a game needs (but no 3D)

Also
Thake care that ASM is not "panaceus universalis" its just as easy in ASM as in any language to make a real bad game. Also you will have to type a little more in ASM but you will have all the speed that the CPU can give you. This speed is nothing used with bad algorithms but even good algorithms can be spoiled by MFC "speed"
Posted on 2002-06-14 09:09:54 by BogdanOntanu
Is this c++ a fast and good language? i do not know programming in c++. Should it be nessessary to learn it for me? I only started to learn asm from some time as it attracted me very much and i love programming in it.:)
Posted on 2002-06-15 07:31:13 by Wonder Mage
Respected Bogdantanu, There is some critical problems with your game 'Hostile Encounter'. I downloaded and installed both main and sprite_555 parts of dec 01 files in the same directory as your website given information. When i run the map editor, it only dispalys main surface and a map window. There are no sprite object to put on the surface. when i press space for 2 times it exits abnormally. 2 problem: When i run the main game file it displays splash screen. when menu is displayed it exits abnormally. These problems are worse, please think about these problems. Also when i run this game on windows xp. only map editor exe runs like but not main game exe. I have 233 MHz mmx cpu with big harddisk and 64 mb ram with 2 mb svga card with 15 inch monitor. Thanks:confused:
Posted on 2002-06-16 07:54:02 by Wonder Mage

I have 233 MHz mmx cpu with big harddisk and 64 mb ram with 2 mb svga card with 15 inch monitor. Thanks:confused:


64 MB ram & WindowsXP ?
You have a lot time, don't you?
Posted on 2002-06-16 07:57:58 by bazik
my system is slow on windows xp. i am now thinking of upgrading it to pentium 4 2.4 Ghz Northwood. making a good and fast program which could still run on old cpus is my priority here.;)
Posted on 2002-06-16 08:16:04 by Wonder Mage
This reminds me of how I started VC on the old Pentium 100 ... lol
A slow system is sometimes much more useful; there'll be more demand on the performance of the code itself.
:)
Posted on 2002-06-16 08:27:04 by C.Z.
Old systems are slow. They could help us to make better programs and think better. Are you running your system from home or from a win32asm office?:)
Posted on 2002-06-16 08:34:05 by Wonder Mage
WonderMage

to play v011 demo of HE you will need at least:

-4 Megabytes Video RAM board. Yes there was a 2M version but we make it on demand and since lately there have been no more such demand we have dropped it.
-DirectX 6.1 at least
-Win2K/XP/Win9x . But i suggest you try Win98 SE first
because there are more bugs in the Win2k/NT/Xp versions
- 128Megabytes RAM (64M or even 32 may also work but slow). I recomend 256M.
- extra 256Mbytes of free space on HDD for swap file.
-IPX network protocol for v011. Or TCP/IP+UDP / IPX for version 0.12 . Required only if you want to play games in a local network or internet.
-for new video boards you may need only the 565 sprite files but to be safe and for older games you might also need the sprites 555 files
- keeep the folder structures from the ZIP file when unzipping

If you still have problems:
1.Start DebugView (free download from www.sysinternals.com) before you start HE.
2.Select Options-Force CR from its menu.
3.Then start HE and after it exits you will see a lot of info in DebugView's window.
4.Send it to us and i will tell you what is wrong.
-- -----------

Indeed the Map Editor is a little strange to use (sorry we did not have time to do its GUI interface until now). If you are intrested i can send you a text file with instructions on how to use Map Editor but this tool is primary for beta testers (not for players yet)

Lots of bugs related to Win2K have been removed (eh and other added) in version 0.12 beta-0 but you have to join our news list and sign a NDA to play or use the latest beta (many nice game design ideeas inside)

We used to have a version of HE that run on a P166/32RAM. But not any more. I guess the onldest demo on our site could still run on that kind of PC (the Black and White version). After the main stream game is done maybe we will come back and make a low stream version also...

PS
-----------------------------------
About the respect stuff:

I am a Zen guy for me "respect" means something dead and connected to the Ego. Ego is the main soul killer AFAIK so that is why i say to you: "do not respect me" i mean no offence ...
Posted on 2002-06-17 18:52:35 by BogdanOntanu
Ok, thanks for the reply. I would upgrade my system to p4 and would test your game on the new system.:)
Posted on 2002-06-20 07:37:02 by Wonder Mage